The LGBTQ+ community, just like the army, is a part of society

Photo courtesy of Viktor Pylypenko

Here, I also have to mention my organisation, the LGBT Military Equal Rights Association, which is the first initiative of this kind in the post-Soviet space. It gathers together Ukrainian servicemen and women who are becoming more and more open about their sexual orientation. Thus, I can say that Ukraine has been experiencing positive social changes.

To me, it seems that this is also the first organisation of this kind in all of Eastern Europe. What are your goals and work methods?

We are registered in the official state register of organisations. However, we were twice refused this status by a clerk who turned out to be religious and homophobic. She even called us nasty names and hindered our registration by bureaucratic means. We managed to get around these issues and first registered in Kramatorsk. We plan to eventually re-register the organisation in Kyiv. We co-operate with Tergo, which is a support group for the parents of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people. They invite us to meetings with teachers and school psychologists, for whom we offer our own personal experiences. Our projects have been supported by the Canadian, Dutch and American embassies, as well as Freedom House. We have made a series of short documentaries about openly gay and lesbian soldiers and we showed it at the Ukrainian Film Festival in Warsaw. We also organised roundtable discussions in which our members and non-LGBTQ+ veterans and politicians participated.

Another activity we conduct is supporting LGBTQ+ soldiers. We organised meetings with psychologists for over one hundred soldiers who needed help not only with their post-traumatic stress disorder or physical injuries but also with accepting their own sexual orientation. In this regard, we co-operate with a group called “peer to peer”, which is run by open lesbian war veteran Nastia Konfederat. Today, this organisation has more than 100 members. Our main goal is education. We want to show our society that there are LGBTQ+ soldiers. The truth is that if we move out of large cities and go to small towns and villages – the places where the majority of our soldiers come from – not many people will know about it. In Mariupol, we were invited onto regional television – this was an interesting experience. We later found out that the viewers’ opinions about what we said were overall positive. We are trying to break away from the Soviet thinking about non-heteronormative people and the army.

Considering that not every soldier can come out, what is your communication strategy?

After I came out, it became clear to me that I will face harassment and that is why I decided to create a Facebook group. An exhibition with photos of LGBTQ+ soldiers also included my photograph, and it was shown to the public by the media. I asked them to share the link to our group in their programmes and it worked out. Many people started to join. I also created closed groups within this community. Those who wanted to join were asked whether they were servicemen or women. If yes, they were asked if they were “friends of Dorothy” (this is a slang question about sexual orientation) or just supporters? Only “friends of Dorothy” were allowed to join the closed groups. From time to time, we would also see blank profiles. Most of them are servicemen who are a bit older, 45+. We call them “fathers”.

Did you ultimately come out for your brothers in arms?

No, I did not do it for them. My mother, my stepfather and my brother all knew. My friends who served with me, they found out earlier too. They accepted my sexual orientation, saying that they had  suspected for some time. They treat it as something normal, sometimes they joke about it. But I do not get offended because I trust them. In the military, I keep it to myself because I try to avoid negative reactions on the part of my supervisors. They could claim that I did not comply with regulations, harass me or even kick me out of the service. This is indirect bullying.

Do you know of such cases?

Yes. My friend was kicked out of the army for “service incompliance”. I do not remember the phrase exactly, but it was something along this line. I know a few gay men who served with me, but they are all afraid.

Did you organise the group? Do you support each other?

Overall, there are many of us in the army. And that is why it hurts me to hear that gay men are not fighting and they opt to stay home. It even happened that many of us knew each other prior to our military service and then we met again in the army.

Is there more homophobia in the army than within society at large?

I think there is less of it, but I cannot assess it properly since people can be different. However, I did not encounter a huge amount of homophobia and that is why I do not know how to answer this. I would rather say that there is more verbal homophobia and that it is observed among those who have not met a gay person yet. I could also see this change among my friends, some of whom were once homophobic.

Don’t you think that with the lack of a right-left divide, especially in Ukrainian media, that the LGBTQ+ community is not perceived as solely a left-wing movement? Could this actually mean that in the future this community will be present in all parts of the political spectrum?

This certainly is a positive thing. I can see what is going on in other European countries. There, the LGBTQ+ community is at a disadvantage because of its political engagement. In Ukraine, we have managed to avoid this. There were attempts to play this card, but we had a feeling that this division was instigated from the outside, suggesting that there are right-wingers and left-wingers and that they need to fight each other.

Exactly. Clearly, nationalistic organisations do not touch this topic at all…

I would say that it even goes beyond that. In our organisation we have members of these groups you are talking about. For example, we have three soldiers from the Azov Battalion. We should note that support for this group is very, very small. Even if all nationalistic organisations were united, they would not get more than two per cent of the vote. This is unlike the German AfD or Marine Le Pen in France.

I would argue with this comparison, as much of France’s right wing is the result of the state’s secularisation policy and has been present in public life since Charles de Gaulle, while the AfD is rather a Putin project…

Marine Le Pen also receives money from Russia. In Ukraine, we have a similar project called “Tradition and Order”. They showed pro-Russian tendencies when they came out to protest and support Viktor Medvedchuk’s TV channels, all the while talking about the violation of their freedom of speech. Russia instigates populist movements in every country as they seem to be in social demand, as it was with antisemitism some time ago. The populists do not need to create anything new. They just take an issue and exploit it. The same was true for anti-immigrant movements or Cambridge Analytica, which was financed by Lukoil. On the other hand, we also need to see that in Ukraine these movements, despite their small social support, have good financing. They quickly go through the state registration procedure and avoid fines for non-compliance. The police often do not react to their activities. It seems to me that the former Minister of Internal Affairs Arsen Avakov divided these groups into right and left wing in order to control the dynamics of street protests. This is also to the advantage of pro-Russian politicians. In Ukraine, radical right-wing movements are very artificial. To illustrate, let me tell you what they often look like. First, some teenagers are seemingly looked after by adults who are in fact implementing their own interests. Then, these kids are “thrown” into activities that are aimed against the LGBTQ+ community.

It also seems to me that the Ukrainian LGBTQ+ community has been under the influence of Russian culture, and especially Russian pop culture. Think about the drag queen artists who follow the example of their counterparts in Moscow…

Let me say that the LGBTQ+ community, just like the army, is a part of the society. That is why it is easy to refute the statement that we are a kind of political element or that we all share the same party line and ideology. The truth is that our community is very diverse. I know many people who have very different views. There are nationalists and those who are pro-Russian. There is also the older generation that has been traumatised by the Soviet experience. That is why our organisation tries to keep its distance from ideological and political disputes. On my Ukrainian flag during the Pride Parade I wrote the military oath that we give to the Ukrainian nation and the constitution. I carried this flag together with my lesbian friend. And this is our greatest value. We are not driven by any political or ideological preferences. As soldiers we are defending all citizens of Ukraine.

I would, however, like to hear more about culture…

The Ukrainian LGBTQ+ community is quite closed in itself. That is why, we – the LGBTQ+ soldiers – place an emphasis on encouraging people to come out. We are doing it on purpose, not just to make  noise. The Razumkov Centre estimates that the most trusted institution in Ukraine is the army. However, it is clear that if many pop stars or cultural icons came out, then that process would accelerate even more. I hope they will take the lead in the future. This would really help the cause. It would lead to the emergence of a Ukrainian culture of acceptance. That is why we are waiting for these stars to be brave and come out. In public discourse, we already talk about such historical figures as Vasyl Vyshyvani (Wilhelm von Habsburg) or Ahatanhel Krymsky. Solomiia Pavlychko wrote about Krymsky in a book titled Nationalism, orientalism and sexuality. There have also been discussions about the platonic love between Lesia Ukrainka and Olga Kobylyanska. This means that in our history we have examples that are worth sharing. Right now, the LGBTQ+ military community has been encouraging the larger LGBTQ+ community to start talking more about themselves.

When it comes to Russia using its culture as a tool of influence, yes they are doing it effectively. This culture is quite simple, easy to absorb and consumerist. That is why millions of people are addicted to its content. It is difficult to counteract. That is why it is good that we have quotas on Ukrainian language content in our media and that we have a law that regulates that. As an activist, I have  supported this law as much as I could. What’s the most important is that we have managed to break through the resistance of those who were convinced that such regulation was not necessary and that it was enough to keep the old system. How can you change things when the whole established machinery is against you?

When talking about the laws, article 161 of Ukraine’s Criminal Code states that any form of discrimination because of race, nationality, religion and other reasons, including being a part of the LGBTQ+ community, is forbidden. Is there then a need for a separate regulation of the situation of the LGBTQ+ community or is it more of an issue of law enforcement?

Indeed this is a problem of law enforcement. Even article 161 of the Criminal Code could be effective if Ukrainian courts and the police were properly reformed. I have recently faced a postponement in a court hearing in the case of an attack against me. It is being done so the case reaches the statute of limitations. This is happening because the judge is not interested in pursuing justice. She herself avoided lustration, even though she was judging activists involved in the Revolution of Dignity. The Ukrainian justice system simply does not work. That is why I have been working with my attorney to file my case with the European Court of Human Rights.  At the same time, it was quite surprising to see the bill on counteracting discrimination due to sexual orientation. It is good that we have it but it came out of nowhere. The Cabinet of Ministers registered it one day, but without conducting any social consultations. To me, it looks like they are just putting on a good show for western partners. However, I have some doubts; I know that even if it is passed as a law it will not deliver much change so long as the courts are not reformed. 

After the Revolution of Dignity, the position of religious communities increased significantly. How tangible is this change and how tempting is it for the authorities to co-operate with them?

Ukraine’s geographic centre and eastern regions are quite indifferent when it comes to religion. The west of Ukraine is much more religious. However, homophobic attitudes are mostly instigated by the Orthodox Church of the Moscow Patriarchate. But, we have also heard some negative comments from representatives of the Orthodox Church of Kyiv Patriarchate, including its head – Metropolitan Epiphanius. According to a Bellingcat investigation, even American conservatives are investing in  movements such as “Love against homosexuality” and members of the Verkhovna Rada, Ukraine’s parliament. These representatives include Sviatoslav Yurash, who created a parliamentary group called “Values. Dignity. Family” that even took part in the National Prayer Breakfast in Washington DC. At the same time, the All-Ukrainian Council of Churches and Religious Organisations unites numerous religious communities based on financial interests and corruption. Members of this organisation have access to the highest levels of our government and are thus able to block anti-discrimination initiatives. They use the term “gender ideology” to cover their corruption schemes.  The so-called ordinary people are not too homophobic, in fact. They live by some myths that can ultimately be overcome. I live in a village near Kyiv and I face no problems when I go to the gym, for example. There is also a gay couple that lives in my village. They were first discriminated against in school but later were accepted. This shows that ordinary people will accept you and have normal reactions to you, as long as you communicate with them.

And what are relations like with the military priests?

I am not Christian. I feel closer to pagan Vedic religion. Many people indeed try to discriminate against me because of my religious views. They tell me that I should be a Christian because this is the religion of my ancestors. But before Christianity, the Rus’ was inhabited by pagans and I feel closer to them. 

How hard is it for someone who is gay to maintain a relationship when doing military service?

I am currently not in a relationship and I do not think I will be until I personally decide to properly date. But I know that there are couples who have waited for each other. And I am jealous of that, but also happy for them. I am in touch online with many people, but I think we still need to meet in person, as things are usually quite different when you are far away.

And what are your political views?

I am for Ukraine. I love my homeland and I am against pro-Russian parties. I support democracy with a touch of socialism. The power has to be that of the people and there has to be justice and equality.

What is the goal of this war?

To bring back Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity within its borders. But also for Crimea to come back. And receive reparations from Russia. In the end, law and order should be introduced on the whole territory of Ukraine.

Translated by Vitalii Mazurenko and Iwona Reichardt

Viktor Pylypenko is a Ukrainian serviceman and founder of an NGO dedicated to supporting LGBTQ+ people serving in the Ukrainian armed forces.

Vitalii Mazurenko is the deputy editor in chief of the portal International Observer (Obserwator Międzynarodowy), a lawyer (human rigts, international public and Ukrainian constitutional law), and a journalist (Ukrainian and Eastern Europien politics, religion, LGBTQ+). He is based in Odesa and Łódź.

Donbas, LGBTQ+, military, Ukraine, War